Kubota Honda

On-going, finished, abandoned builds & questions galore..

Moderators: Dan J, Stuart, Diesel Dave, Crazymanneil

Tim
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 74
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:48 am
Location: Somerset

Kubota Honda

Post by Tim » Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:36 pm

Kubota Z482 Honda Superdream from Somerset
Hi all
I like my current Superdream fitted with a cloned Yanmar 186 engine . I fancy something swifter and smoother for the next Big Knock meeting.
Current Bike
IMG_2096.JPG
Yanmar 186 clone fitted in Honda Superdream
Specifications of the new build
Create a super simple conversion, requiring minimal technical and minimal machining skills. Low cost is a priority
Engine Kubota Z482-E removed from an Aixam car, Transmission CVT type belt drive from the same Aixam This 1990 model with gearbox problems purchased from Ebay for £300. Road Tax refund generated £90 and I sold the rest of the car for £100
The Donor bike was a Honda Superdream 400 non runner with fairing and top box for £200
Bill so total
This makes the total outlay £310 for the engine , transmission and bike

Using the CVT transmission from the Aixam will sort the clutch and primary transmission + ratio changes.
The Aixam transfer box will be replaced with a counter shaft fitted with a toothed flat belt drive to the rear wheel .

I am hoping there is sufficient width to allow the toothed drive on the same side as the CVT . If not I will flip the rear wheel to get the drive on the other side
Picture 048.jpg
The Superdream as purchased
Picture 051.jpg
The Aixam Engine and CVT transmission
Picture 011.jpg
The two together , I prefer the inclined look
In a funny way the start for this project is the rear belt drive as preferred sizes and lengths means I will gear it for theoretical 78Mph at max RPM
This translates to the final drive ratio of 6:1 and pans out to a 24 tooth front pulley and a whopping 144 tooth rear pulley and 30mm wide belt looks OK but will be tight in width clearance.
On the look up chart with 1800mm long belt the pulley centres would be 542 mm apart which is looking possible
Cost pulleys £120 for both + Belt @£25
Picture 078.jpg
Toothed pulley needs to be machine to reduce weight and fit on the rear wheel then bolted into position
Next job is to sort the jack shaft. This in mounted in two bolt flange self aligning bearings on 25mm ID the right hand 20mm ID
With this I can now make some ply wood pattern engine plates to sort out the alignment and critical distances before manufacturing the alloy set.
I have got over excited working on the build and failed to record the progress . Here is the finished product as yet untested!
superdream III 1.jpg
superdream III 2.jpg
Attachments
Picture 095.jpg
Plywood mock up plates checking if all will fit and look OK
Last edited by Tim on Wed May 15, 2013 7:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mouse
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:30 pm
Location: S Wales
Contact:

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by Mouse » Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:23 pm

Looks good.
You wont be disappointed with the Kubota Z482. I've just clocked up about 15000 miles on my BMW Z482 conversion and the engine is solid and has never let me down.

What are you using for an alternator?
Kubota Z482 which is plodding on with unnerving reliability. Three years so far.
1900 Diesel Bike being rebuilt with better clutch control.

User avatar
coachgeo
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 1997
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:00 am
Location: USA Ohio, Above Cincinnati, Close to Dayton

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by coachgeo » Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:56 pm

Can you pull the part numbers off the Aixam drive and driven pulley? Wanting to compare and see (if these are made by CVTech like folk assume, which model they are. Do you have a source for these? Model number for Axiams of other Micro cars that used this set up would be helpfull too.

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:36 am

Hi Tim

Just seen this, glad you are going through with the Z482 superdream as I am also doing something similar with an XJ600.

How does the Aixam CVT drive the rear wheels when its actually in the car? Are you going to have a belt drive to the back wheel?

gilburton
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:35 am
Location: UK northants

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gilburton » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:11 pm

The aixam is front wheel drive. It has a gearbox that gives forward and reverse and a small diff to the drive shafts.I believe Tim is removing the gearbox and discarding it and mounting the rear pulley on a jack shaft. Mine is a 3/4" jack shaft. This is mounted on 2 pillow block bearings on a vertical steel plate and the final drive sprocket or pulley can be mounted on this shaft also.
It might be possible to keep the gearbox and lock up the diff and mount a sprocket on a drive shaft output?? but this would depend on available room and these gearboxes aren't known for being reliable :(
Attachments
gearbox-aixam.jpg
The gearbox is mounted vertically. The keyed shaft is on top with the driven pulley and the drive shafts are below.
Last edited by gilburton on Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:19 pm

Aha I see what you mean, I did think that block was a diff of some sort. Seems relatively easy to get a sprocket off the end of that.

If I can pickup an Aixam engine+gearbox I can use the existing CVT to either use it in that form, or use the CVT to make an adapter to drive my gearbox :)

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:27 pm

Hmm yeah it will also introduce drive train losses.

Does it a take drive from a splined shaft that comes from the CVT? I could pull the box apart to get the shaft, depending on what is available.

Hmm Should be able to work something out.

gilburton
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:35 am
Location: UK northants

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gilburton » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:31 pm

You won't need your own gearbox??? I doubt if there will be room for the Aixam gearbox either.

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:36 pm

I am thinking of 2 options.

1. Use the whole power plant like Tim is doing - The problem is I dont like CVT's that much.
2. Use my Villiers box - this should handle 15bhp no problem - the issue is getting a sprocket onto the flywheel of the engine, if I had the CVT arrangment, I could look at how the CVT attaches to the flywheel, and either butcher that part, or replicate it with a sprocket on it :) (and then be able to run a dual row chain to the gearbox ) :)

(that's what I mean with the above, sorry my thought rambling posts)

gilburton
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:35 am
Location: UK northants

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gilburton » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:43 pm

If you look at Tim's pic, the one with the flywheel facing you and the plywood mounting brackets, blow the pic up and you will see the small tapered shaft that the cvt pulley mounts to. This is just bolted to the flywheel bolts. You could get a round plate welded to this so that would accept sprockets?? I believe these are available commercially at industrial drive suppliers.
Or get a 1" or 25mm stub made up with a key way and weld that to the adapter then you could fit taper lock sprockets.
If you hunt around industrial machine suppliers you will probably be able to get a straight adapter to fit the Kubota. :D

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:24 pm

Aha yes, it seems that is an easy way to go

I was thinking a round plate, with a 1-inch stub axle. That would just then bolt to the flywheel :)

I have had a look on some industrial machine websites but find it impossible to find anything, they are geared up for people calling them I think.

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:32 pm

It would be great if there was just an adpater i could buy, bolt to the flywheel, and have a sprocket on the end! sorted!

gilburton
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:35 am
Location: UK northants

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gilburton » Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:24 pm

I would look for Kubota dealers in the UK and possibly in the U.S. as well(I got my jack shaft from there) as I expect it will be expensive over here.
I enquired about an adapter for my Robin engine and they quoted £75 for one!!!!
Possibly someone on the forum who has access to machining etc could help you out when you get the engine??
As I have said on a previous post it would be better to get the complete engine/transmission as Tim has done then you can sell off the bits you don't want.
If you get a complete car you will also get the radiator,alternator etc. :)

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:36 pm

True

I will aim to get the whole engine and gearbox etc, would do the car, but I wouldn't have anywhere to put it.

im sure I can pick up an engine with gearbox + alternator etc still attached to it (maybe minus rad and pipes etc)

Mouse has helpefully pointed me out to a hacker space local to me which has machining facilities (and crucially, help me to use them!), so I will give that a go too.

I think this is all speculating type stuff, If I have the engine in front of me, it will be much easier to think of various options as the stuff will be right there (if that makes sense...)

Mouse
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:30 pm
Location: S Wales
Contact:

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by Mouse » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:18 pm

alexanderfoti wrote: Mouse has helpefully pointed me out to a hacker space local to me which has machining facilities (and crucially, help me to use them!), so I will give that a go too.
Today is Thursday, why not go over tot he hack space and introduce yourself.....
Kubota Z482 which is plodding on with unnerving reliability. Three years so far.
1900 Diesel Bike being rebuilt with better clutch control.

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:19 pm

Today isnt good (gf commitements) but next week it will be on my list!

pietenpol2002
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:56 pm
Location: Goshen, IN USA

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by pietenpol2002 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:09 am

It would be great if there was just an adpater i could buy, bolt to the flywheel, and have a sprocket on the end! sorted!

Kubota does indeed make a stub shaft adapter for the flywheel as seen in the pics below. Not cheap from Kubota. But these engines were used a good deal in refrigeration applications where the compressor was driven by a pulley on the flywheel. You might also consider snooping around a breaker who specializes in such things to see what they have. Mouse might know more about that sort of thing. And if the flywheel is drilled to common SAE dimensions, any number of companies supply SAE stub shaft adapters. But again, not cheap.
Kubota Stub Shaft 1.jpg
Kubota Stub Shaft 3.jpg
Kubota Stub Shaft 2.jpg
Ron
Goshen, IN USA

gearhead1951
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 129
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:04 am
Location: scotland uk

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gearhead1951 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:21 am

That adapter looks like fairly simple part to make on a lathe , two piece if needed !!

Mouse
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:30 pm
Location: S Wales
Contact:

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by Mouse » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:43 am

alexanderfoti wrote:Today isnt good (gf commitements)
Take her with you.
Kubota Z482 which is plodding on with unnerving reliability. Three years so far.
1900 Diesel Bike being rebuilt with better clutch control.

pietenpol2002
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:56 pm
Location: Goshen, IN USA

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by pietenpol2002 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:58 pm

That adapter looks like fairly simple part to make on a lathe , two piece if needed !!
And here are the dimensions if it's the B1 flywheel pattern.

Bolt Circle: 130 mm (5.12”)

5 bolt pattern: thread hole size M8 thread pitch 1.25

Pilot Diameter: 106 mm (4.17”)
Ron
Goshen, IN USA

toyotaracer9
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 74
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:58 pm
Location: New Orleans La. USA

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by toyotaracer9 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:16 pm

pietenpol2002 wrote:
That adapter looks like fairly simple part to make on a lathe , two piece if needed !!
And here are the dimensions if it's the B1 flywheel pattern.

Bolt Circle: 130 mm (5.12”)

5 bolt pattern: thread hole size M8 thread pitch 1.25

Pilot Diameter: 106 mm (4.17”)

I made one for a kubota with 1/2" plate and 1-3/4" shaft tapered to 1-1/8" for the comet 94c.
If it isn't broken , break it .

User avatar
coachgeo
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 1997
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:00 am
Location: USA Ohio, Above Cincinnati, Close to Dayton

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by coachgeo » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:37 pm

coachgeo wrote:Can you pull the part numbers off the Aixam drive and driven pulley? Wanting to compare and see (if these are made by CVTech like folk assume, which model they are. Do you have a source for these? Model number for Axiams of other Micro cars that used this set up would be helpfull too.
Aixam CVT info here viewtopic.php?f=41&t=2445

User avatar
coachgeo
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 1997
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:00 am
Location: USA Ohio, Above Cincinnati, Close to Dayton

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by coachgeo » Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:23 am

Aixam has a stub shaft on engine flywheel?

http://bildepan.frontosa.se/shop/defaul ... howKat=560 Granted this is from a Kubota 602 drawing on a parts page for Aixams

30 1666784521 FLANGE WITH TAPERED SHAFT. PULLEY MOUNTING

pietenpol2002
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:56 pm
Location: Goshen, IN USA

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by pietenpol2002 » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:33 am

Or if you're a scrounger and have access to old Porshe (pre-1990) or certain VW parts, some utilized a 5 bolt 130mm pattern. Snag a scrap brake disc off the pile and chuck it in the lathe for a jump start on your stub shaft project.

http://www.vwkaeferersatzteile.de/image ... 1371_0.jpg
Ron
Goshen, IN USA

dieselbikin
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 171
Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:49 pm
Location: United States, Athens, AL

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by dieselbikin » Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:28 am

1980 Suzuki 550
10 HP Yanclone
94C Comet

alexanderfoti
Site Admin
Posts: 1256
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:22 pm
Location: London

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by alexanderfoti » Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:48 pm

At the moments its all theory, I am completely skint, so will be mainly moving my 400 yan clone over to my xj600, at the moment the engine is running really well, but the superdream is falling apart around it. I am starting it every 2-3 weeks but its not really ridable :( Ii will be keeping these threads in mind though :)

Tim
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 74
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:48 am
Location: Somerset

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by Tim » Tue May 14, 2013 4:33 pm

Mouse wrote:Looks good.
You wont be disappointed with the Kubota Z482. I've just clocked up about 15000 miles on my BMW Z482 conversion and the engine is solid and has never let me down.

What are you using for an alternator?
Hi Mouse
Sorry for the slow responce I have shoved it behind the engine. I may need an idler if the belt wrap on the crank pully is not sufficent and slips !

Cheers Tim
Attachments
alternator.jpg

gilburton
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:35 am
Location: UK northants

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by gilburton » Wed May 15, 2013 2:32 pm

You've obviously done a lot of work on it already! Looking good :D

BertTrack
I luv the smell of Diesel...
Posts: 323
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 3:53 am
Location: Netherlands

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by BertTrack » Thu Jun 06, 2013 8:37 pm

Tim

Having seen it at the Big Knock i have to say I love that conversion.
Image

User avatar
Stuart
Site Admin
Posts: 2159
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:08 pm
Location: Horsham West Sussex, England
Contact:

Re: Kubota Honda

Post by Stuart » Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:06 pm

I think Mouse has more questions about the water pump?

Post Reply