Diesel Single Bobber Build

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radicalnegative1
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Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:48 pm

Hello everyone,


I am a college student here in the U.S. who does not like paying for gas. This will (hopefully) be my solution to that.

I'm building a low and stretched bobber type motorcycle based off of this 418cc knock off. The engine is manufactured by Wuxi Engines in China. They make some big stuff... hopefully that translates to quality. The engine I got looks good overall. Much better than some of the clones I've snatched off eBay or Harbor Freight in the past.

Anyway, the plan is to make this thing CVT driven and turbocharged. The donor bike is a rough 1969 Honda CL450 that I got from a guy across my state.

Progress Pics Below.

radicalnegative1
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:59 pm

A short album of the engine can be found here:
http://imgur.com/a/Q9DgS

Image

Image

Image

Although right now it seems the website is down. Hopefully that'll clear up.
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V__05BE.jpg
Donor Bike

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Stuart
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by Stuart » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:02 pm

Hi :-) Keep us informed as to how your build goes. Running a turbo on a single may not be practical though?..
Stuart. Honda NC700S, Ducati Monster M900, Toyota Corolla 1.4 Turbo Diesel. Favouring MPG over MPH.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by toyotaracer9 » Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:33 am

These engines have pressurized oiling?
If it isn't broken , break it .

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by pietenpol2002 » Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:21 pm

Welcome and great to see pics of your project. You're now the 2nd builder of a diesel fired 450 bobber here. Can you bring us up to speed on where you're located and what you're planning with regard to CVT?
Ron
Goshen, IN USA

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by gearhead1951 » Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:57 am

Do what Roger Goldammer did to a Buell Blast , he removed the turbine from a turbocharger and installed a cogged pulley to run off of the sprocket shaft at the engine and mounted the (newly created) supercharger behind the engine .

The supercharger (if memory serves me) was set at 3.5 to 1 to provide 10 lbs of boost at 5000 engine rpm and the intake tract (from the 'charger to the cylinder head) was 1000cc's of displacement to smooth out the pulsation in the tract as the engine ran !

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Wed Nov 28, 2012 8:18 pm

pietenpol2002 wrote:Welcome and great to see pics of your project. You're now the 2nd builder of a diesel fired 450 bobber here. Can you bring us up to speed on where you're located and what you're planning with regard to CVT?
Who did the first one?

And I go to the University of Alabama, however I am from the Cincinnati, Ohio area (the bike is being built there).




As far as the effectiveness of the turbo:

I'm not really looking to get significant boost out of the turbo - more just eliminating the vacuum in the intake. I'd really be happy with 4-5 psi boost. This guy has nearly an identical setup and gets a max of 7 psi. I don't think I'd trust the engine past that.

The parts for the plenum chamber came in today, too. I'm just using some 2" PVC and fittings cut to length for that ballpark 3:1 ratio.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by pietenpol2002 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 1:15 am

Who did the first one?
The link is below. Sadly, his pictures magically disappeared. Perhaps they were linked to a hosting site and thus no longer available. However, there is the Youtube link below to give you some idea of what it is.

http://www.suckindiesel.com/thingy/view ... ber#p11846

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiszQAn9 ... e=youtu.be
Ron
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:45 am

Thanks.

I really like his bike! I hope mine will turn out similar.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Thu Nov 29, 2012 2:41 pm

I have a V twin with the same turbo. The blowby created by the turbo can be a real problem. But for sure you must move the PVC so it does not dump into the intake or you wil pressurize the crankcase. this vidoe will help http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aE_ftgNpOV4 The V twins are still bad enough that they require an air oil separtor even though they run a large third vent in the valley between cylinder and in both rocker boxes. I don't know if I would put the vent into the intake until I was sure it would not pump crankcase oil into the intake under boost (runaway might happen). Keep the turbo drain back tube as straight as possible and don't reduce its diameter. I will be building a bike for my daughter with the same setup next year so I look forward to your results.


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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:22 pm

DieselFly -

What about blocking the PCV valve with epoxy or something and installing a breather on the crankcase cover?

Also, to where did you drain your turbo? Did you drill a hole in the crankcase cover or go through one of the oil fills?

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by gearhead1951 » Thu Nov 29, 2012 7:28 pm

I also remember an article in Street Rodder mag a few years back about a builder that used an electric motor powered centrifugal supercharger on a little fwd car ( scroll and impeller came from a gas powered leaf blower) .

It only made about 3 - 4 psi of boost but that was enough for an 8 hp gain !

The stock ECU was able to compensate and no other mods were required !

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by Rhynri » Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:24 pm

Honda John used a pond aerator for his. He's still working the kinks (he needs to increase the ratio) but he's put 4 psi into it so far. Here is the link to the thread. It may be an option.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:29 pm

I just used 1/4-20 tap and tapped the hole in the head and plugged it with a set screw. You can see where they plugged the passages for the vent system in the rocker covers. I pulled the little platic vavle out of the inside and drilled one of the plugs out and tapped it with a 1/4" pipe thread and screwed a 3/8" barbed fitting in. I designed up a air oil separator to dump the vents into or I would need to stop every 20 miles for oil
radicalnegative1 wrote:DieselFly -

What about blocking the PCV valve with epoxy or something and installing a breather on the crankcase cover?

Also, to where did you drain your turbo? Did you drill a hole in the crankcase cover or go through one of the oil fills?
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:45 pm

Forgot you drain back question. I drilled a hole in the top of block an tapped it with a 3/8" pipe thread so its a straight run back into the block with a 1/2' tube. I read somewhere that someone drained it back in one of the fill holes. The twins only have one fill hole and it is wrapped way around the back so it was no practical to use it. I wanted to use a piece of finned copper tube like what you find on compressors to help cool the return oil. There are some pretty cool little intercoolers on Ebay that will help bump your power and cool things down a little bit. I may add an intercooler to mine this winter but it is a long way down the list of projects this year.

Sean
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by XLerate » Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:56 pm

Hey, RadNeg, just a quick tip: I live a ways from civilization, middle of nowhere. Had some leftovers from a Honda 450, decided to put the engine up on Craigslist. A guy called right away and I got several other calls. He was here in a heartbeat the same day, driving 75 miles on treacherous roads to buy the beater engine in unknown condition for $100. He was tickled pink. Turns out these things are very collectible to a certain crowd and parts are worth a mint, hint hint hint. Your leftovers may help a lot to finance your build!

Hope it all turns out well for you.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by toyotaracer9 » Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:47 am

DieselFly wrote: There are some pretty cool little intercoolers on Ebay that will help bump your power and cool things down a little bit. I may add an intercooler to mine this winter but it is a long way down the list of projects this year.

Sean

You can get a core from http://www.bellintercoolers.com/_pages/coreAirCore.html and fab some endtanks for a better price and fit that ebay. I am sure that would be a ways down the road but at 10psi mine was making IAT around 165f so 4lbs should be quite a bit lower.
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by XLerate » Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:30 am

"...mine was making IAT around 165f..." Huh????

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by coachgeo » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:15 am

pietenpol2002 wrote:
Who did the first one?
The link is below. Sadly, his pictures magically disappeared. ...

http://www.suckindiesel.com/thingy/view ... ber#p11846

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiszQAn9 ... e=youtu.be
Emailed him and asked if he would kindly fix his thread here. He was happy too and now has done so. Sweet pics in there. Check it out.. With that in mind..... RadicalNeg, so this thread does not loose it's archive value.. please upload your pics to this site instead of having them hosted elsewhere. Just edit your threads and and upload them.


note: Justing has since traded the bike in the fixed thread to a fellow in the Dakota's I believe. Im going to try to talk the fellow into coming here and give us an update on mod's he's done

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by pietenpol2002 » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:31 am

Thanks for retrieving those pics Coach. Great to see them again. Have a look radicalnegative - and should you choose to go the Comet 40 route, be in touch. I've got an unused set as well as a bunch of belts and jackshafts I'd be willing to part with.
Ron
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:53 am

IAT= intake air temp 165 degrees F. And at 10 psi 165F is very good
XLerate wrote:"...mine was making IAT around 165f..." Huh????
Last edited by DieselFly on Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by XLerate » Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:33 pm

DieselFly wrote:IAT= intake air temp also called TIT turbine inlet temp 165 ddegrees F would be the temaerature. And at 10 psi 165F is very good
XLerate wrote:"...mine was making IAT around 165f..." Huh????
Thanks!

Some forums have this clubby little insider, the cool people, chummy thing going. Every post is filled with nothing but abbreviations, I mean dozens, and hardly a word of text is given for even the faintest hint what it's all about.

Real hard for a person who's still in a learning curve or has a lousy memory or both...

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:44 pm

Not clubby just speaking turbo. Maybe the 30+ years of turbos and gas turbines makes me forget to explain things 8)
XLerate wrote:
DieselFly wrote:IAT= intake air temp also called TIT turbine inlet temp 165 ddegrees F would be the temaerature. And at 10 psi 165F is very good
XLerate wrote:"...mine was making IAT around 165f..." Huh????
Thanks!

Some forums have this clubby little insider, the cool people, chummy thing going. Every post is filled with nothing but abbreviations, I mean dozens, and hardly a word of text is given for even the faintest hint what it's all about.

Real hard for a person who's still in a learning curve or has a lousy memory or both...
Finished and riding 1975
CB500t Turbo Punsun powered
hardtail.

radicalnegative1
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Fri Nov 30, 2012 7:13 pm

DieselFly - Did you have any issues drilling into your engine? Any crack propagation? How'd tapping the hole go for you?

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by gearhead1951 » Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:16 pm

The us navy made me so sick of acronyms that absolutly refuse to use them since I retired !!

Well , except for the ones that have been in use so long that anyone who works with engines knows them without question ( rpm , mph , cid ect....)

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:40 am

No problem drilling the block. The casting on the twins are very porous and almost crumble when taping. Looking at your pictures you may want to install you primary clutch first as your drain tube looks like it will hit where your turbo is mounted. You might want to pop the side cover and look for a thick area in the block of say at least 1/4". if you can get to one of the fill holes that would be easiest. If you have to put a slight slope in the line you should be okay just don't reduce the diameter.
radicalnegative1 wrote:DieselFly - Did you have any issues drilling into your engine? Any crack propagation? How'd tapping the hole go for you?
Last edited by DieselFly on Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by radicalnegative1 » Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:01 am

Yeah, that drain tube was the one that came with the restrictor kit. I have another flange that I'll weld a shorter barb fitting on to.

My first choice for the drain would be the oil fill hole, but I'm not familiar with BST.
Does anyone know what the threads are for the oil fill holes of these engines (I am away from my engine, otherwise I'd measure)? They're for sure metric, but no hardware stores around me have any clue how metric pipe sizes work.

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by coachgeo » Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:18 am

DieselFly wrote:.... Looking at your pictures you may want to install you driven clutch first as your drain tube looks like it will hit where your turbo is mounted....
Assume you mean Drive clutch or Primary Clutch. The terms are confusing. Driven is the Secondary clutch. as in it is "driven" by the primary/drive clutch that is spun via the crank

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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by DieselFly » Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:14 pm

Looks like you have the same line kit I used. The fill cap has a very coarse thread but you could cut the dip stick and finger tab off. Then drill and tap it to take a standard pipe thread. I hear you on metric hardware. Canada went metric in 1976 yet you can't buy it at most hardware stores and when you can its twice the price and don't even ask for metric pipe fittings.
radicalnegative1 wrote:Yeah, that drain tube was the one that came with the restrictor kit. I have another flange that I'll weld a shorter barb fitting on to.

My first choice for the drain would be the oil fill hole, but I'm not familiar with BST.
Does anyone know what the threads are for the oil fill holes of these engines (I am away from my engine, otherwise I'd measure)? They're for sure metric, but no hardware stores around me have any clue how metric pipe sizes work.
Finished and riding 1975
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Re: Diesel Single Bobber Build

Post by Rhynri » Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:07 pm

coachgeo wrote:
DieselFly wrote:.... Looking at your pictures you may want to install you driven clutch first as your drain tube looks like it will hit where your turbo is mounted....
Assume you mean Drive clutch or Primary Clutch. The terms are confusing. Driven is the Secondary clutch. as in it is "driven" by the primary/drive clutch that is spun via the crank
That's what happens when you let an engineer name something. :P

I tease, of course. Yes the terms are very confusing.

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